Rank the 12 schools in value to the new league

[GumbyDamnit!]

This thread can't possibly end well. We're measuring phallus size here.

Having said that, PC has 2 FF's and 2 E8's.

And no one under 40 knows who the Friars are. But they all know Gonzaga. And they all know McDermott. Providence is riding coattails and everyone knows it.

Man, now you're making me feel old...! Looking forward to the new league. I wish it could start this coming November.

Was thinking the same billyjack. Remeber the glory days of PC with Pitino and Billy the Kid. Would put you ahead of SHU on my list the more I think of it.

[Dew]

Narrowing it down to the last 20 or so years would probably give you a better idea. In all honesty, Butler is where they are based on the last couple of years and not much else. I guess the point is that recent memory is more valuable than old tradition.

[butlerguy03]

Narrowing it down to the last 20 or so years would probably give you a better idea. In all honesty, Butler is where they are based on the last couple of years and not much else. I guess the point is that recent memory is more valuable than old tradition.

What?!

1997: First round loss to Cincinnati
1998: First round loss to New Mexico
2000: First round loss to Florida (on a last second buzzer beater)
2001: Defeated Wake Forest, Round of 32 loss to Arizona (who they played earlier in the season, the NCAA later admitted its error in the early tournament matchup)
2002: May be the most infamous team to miss the tournament in history- changed the landscape in the Horizon league and many others.
From USA Today:

After the 2002 snub, NCAA insiders let Butler know it should not have happened. "I think that team did something for college basketball," Lickliter said. "I think the RPI and the way they evaluate it changed."

2003: Defeated Mississippi State & Louisville, Lost to Oklahoma in Sweet 16 (tight game until the end)
2007: Defeated Old Dominion & Maryland, Lost to Florida (eventual National Champion - the closest game the Gators had the entire tournament)
2008: Defeated South Alabama, Lost to Tennessee in the round of 32
2009: First round loss to LSU
2010: National Championship Game
2011: National Championship Game

16-10 since 1997. That's not a few years, that's a track record of success.

Butler has become a national brand, bigger than most of the 300+ schools in the NCAA. If this C7+5 comes about, I'd say they are in the top 3-4 name brands in the new league for ESPN, FOX, or whoever ends up with the TV rights, behind Georgetown, Marquette and maybe Xavier.

[whiteandblue77]

This is RIGHT NOW... for those youngguns who like to live in the moment

1. Creighton (ranking and rpi)
2. Butler (ranking and rpi)
3. Georgetown (ranking not rpi)
4. Marquette (Higher rpi than GTown, Hoyas ranked higher)
5. Seton Hall (52 rpi)
6. SLU (56 rpi)
7. St. Johns (68 rpi)
8. Dayton (76 rpi )
9. Villanova (99 rpi )
10. Xavier (112 rpi )
11. Providence (154 rpi )
12. DePaul (180 rpi )

[GumbyDamnit!]

Narrowing it down to the last 20 or so years would probably give you a better idea. In all honesty, Butler is where they are based on the last couple of years and not much else. I guess the point is that recent memory is more valuable than old tradition.

What?!

1997: First round loss to Cincinnati
1998: First round loss to New Mexico
2000: First round loss to Florida (on a last second buzzer beater)
2001: Defeated Wake Forest, Round of 32 loss to Arizona (who they played earlier in the season, the NCAA later admitted its error in the early tournament matchup)
2002: May be the most infamous team to miss the tournament in history- changed the landscape in the Horizon league and many others.
From USA Today:

After the 2002 snub, NCAA insiders let Butler know it should not have happened. "I think that team did something for college basketball," Lickliter said. "I think the RPI and the way they evaluate it changed."

2003: Defeated Mississippi State & Louisville, Lost to Oklahoma in Sweet 16 (tight game until the end)
2007: Defeated Old Dominion & Maryland, Lost to Florida (eventual National Champion - the closest game the Gators had the entire tournament)
2008: Defeated South Alabama, Lost to Tennessee in the round of 32
2009: First round loss to LSU
2010: National Championship Game
2011: National Championship Game

16-10 since 1997. That's not a few years, that's a track record of success.

Butler has become a national brand, bigger than most of the 300+ schools in the NCAA. If this C7+5 comes about, I'd say they are in the top 3-4 name brands in the new league for ESPN, FOX, or whoever ends up with the TV rights, behind Georgetown, Marquette and maybe Xavier.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Fist off, don't forget Nova when it comes to the TV rights. They carry more weight than Marq and Xavier--saying that as a Nova fan of course

Interesting when you look at the last 10 years. I definitely do not mean to present this data to be critical but it really is a tale of two leagues. There are the top half that have performed well and the bottom half that has not. This will be critical as better teams mean more bids which means more collective money. If I were head of the league I would offer the top 5 more than the bottom 5, or 7 becasue the #'s don't lie. Using that as the criteria I would like to ammend my list to the following:

1. Butler - 2 FF's, 15-6 tourney record (impressive to say the least; Butler we need you and we are psyched to call you brother in our league)
2. Nova - 1 FF, 12-6 tourney (my squad; they will be back and expect them to be consistently in top half of new league)
3. Marquette 1 FF; 10-8 tourney record (solid addition to BE a decade ago; like their program a lot)
4. G'town - 1 FF; 8-6 tourney record (I was expecting better to be honest)
5. Xavier - 14-9 tourney record (always a tough program in yrs past; expecting to see the same in yrs ahead; solid)
6-12 in no particular order:
Depaul 1-1
St. Louis 1-1
Seton Hall 1-2
Dayton 1-3
Creighton 1-4 (was expecting better; thought they would have at least won a couple games in the tourney over the past 10 yrs; disappointed a little in that)
St. John's 0-1 (need them; Lavin needs to get them back; early recent departures hurt:M.Harkless; have confidence in them)
Providence 0-1 (very disappointing; like SHU they need to step up their game)

[vu97]

Narrowing it down to the last 20 or so years would probably give you a better idea. In all honesty, Butler is where they are based on the last couple of years and not much else. I guess the point is that recent memory is more valuable than old tradition.

What?!

1997: First round loss to Cincinnati
1998: First round loss to New Mexico
2000: First round loss to Florida (on a last second buzzer beater)
2001: Defeated Wake Forest, Round of 32 loss to Arizona (who they played earlier in the season, the NCAA later admitted its error in the early tournament matchup)
2002: May be the most infamous team to miss the tournament in history- changed the landscape in the Horizon league and many others.
From USA Today:

After the 2002 snub, NCAA insiders let Butler know it should not have happened. "I think that team did something for college basketball," Lickliter said. "I think the RPI and the way they evaluate it changed."

2003: Defeated Mississippi State & Louisville, Lost to Oklahoma in Sweet 16 (tight game until the end)
2007: Defeated Old Dominion & Maryland, Lost to Florida (eventual National Champion - the closest game the Gators had the entire tournament)
2008: Defeated South Alabama, Lost to Tennessee in the round of 32
2009: First round loss to LSU
2010: National Championship Game
2011: National Championship Game

16-10 since 1997. That's not a few years, that's a track record of success.

Butler has become a national brand, bigger than most of the 300+ schools in the NCAA. If this C7+5 comes about, I'd say they are in the top 3-4 name brands in the new league for ESPN, FOX, or whoever ends up with the TV rights, behind Georgetown, Marquette and maybe Xavier.

Um..I think you forgot to mention Villanova, which was ranked #16 basketball program of all time from the past 50 years

[butlerguy03]

Meant no disrespect to 'Nova. I'd say this new league will have a significant 4 national name brands in Butler, Georgetown, Villanova & Xavier. That's a significant start to a TV deal and those 4 will get most of the national TV airtime. Let's hope whichever network lands the NewBE, they have more outlets than just one channel that overlooks any league game not involving those 4 or so. I'd still like to see Dayton-Providence, even if both were middling and I had to get on ESPN3 or some other site.

[Peter]

Meant no disrespect to 'Nova. I'd say this new league will have a significant 4 national name brands in Butler, Georgetown, Villanova & Xavier. That's a significant start to a TV deal and those 4 will get most of the national TV airtime. Let's hope whichever network lands the NewBE, they have more outlets than just one channel that overlooks any league game not involving those 4 or so. I'd still like to see Dayton-Providence, even if both were middling and I had to get on ESPN3 or some other site.

Marquette > Xavier

[Marq05]

I would say 5 national brands. Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, Butler and Xavier. Marquette has its worst talent since 2005 and will still be in the tourney this year. Next year, they have a top 10 recruiting class coming in and some of the nation's top talent in their backyard for 2014 and 15. I see Marquette making multiple deep tournament runs in the next few years.

[butlerguy03]

Doesn't this sort of settle it, then. Why add more than Butler, Creighton & Xavier? If you're not getting added exposure from Dayton or St. Louis, why add them?

Butler
Creighton
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
Seton Hall
St. John's
Villanova
Xavier

All are national or traditional basketball name brands. Most are in very large markets. The addition of Butler adds the Indiana recruits to the NY/NJ, Chicago, Philly and DC areas. The 3 added teams sell out arenas and are no stranger to the national attention that a major basketball conference would bring.